Living without fear – Daniel Williams

Daniel Williams is the founder of several successful businesses and Certified EOS Implementer. Yet few know of the struggle he has had for most of his life with managing his mental health. There have been some difficult times for Daniel as he has progressed through his life and some amazing
breakthroughs.

In this episode Daniel opens up about how he navigates his personal journey, his conversations with leadership teams in his EOS practice and the commencement of his latest venture, Without Fear.

Without Fear is a clothing label that exists to inspire others to live without the fear of seeking help with their mental health. It all starts with a conversation, like this one on Gripping Business Tales.

Transcript

Murray Smith: Dan Williams from Independent EQ, thanks for joining me on Gripping Business Tales.

Daniel Williams: Thanks for having me, Murray—it’s a pleasure.

Murray: This isn’t your first time on the show, but today we’re here to talk about something a little different—not EOS implementation, although I suspect there’ll be some crossover with leadership teams and so on. We’re here to talk about your new venture, Without Fear. But before we dive into that, could you start as we usually do—with a personal and a professional best?

Daniel: Sure. Thanks for putting me on the spot—and for the opportunity to talk about this topic.
Personally, we’ve been doing some significant renovations at home, and you reach a point where you think, “I can’t really see where my money’s going.” We’ve just crossed that threshold, and with the weather improving in Melbourne, our backyard is starting to feel like something we can enjoy this summer.

Murray: Nice.
Daniel: That’s definitely a personal win. Professionally, it would have to be launching Without Fear. I hesitate to categorise it as purely professional or personal—it’s really both. The support so far has been overwhelming.

Murray: So, let’s dive into Without Fear. You’re the founder or co-founder of a number of businesses here in Australia—and now potentially globally—which suggests your time is already stretched. And now you’ve launched something new. Tell us about Without Fear and what motivated you to start it on top of everything else.

Daniel: Yeah, I do have a lot on the go, but everything I do is aligned with my purpose. Each venture fuels the others.
Without Fear is about helping people overcome fear as a barrier to having conversations about mental health. In my work—as a coach, EOS Implementer, and business founder—I’m often working with business leaders who are either struggling themselves or supporting someone with mental health challenges.
So Without Fear is my way to support all of that—to open up space for conversations that aren’t happening enough in our communities.

Murray: Why the name?
Daniel: I’ve suffered from mental ill-health for most of my adult life—everything from anxiety to depression. Many times, I didn’t feel ready to talk about it or seek help. When I really break that down, it came down to fear: fear of what others would think, fear of being judged, fear of being seen as less capable.
Being in leadership roles only amplified that. There’s a pressure to appear strong and stoic. But when I’ve created safe spaces for leaders to open up, they have—and I’ve been able to support them through that. The common thread in all of this is fear.

Now, Without Fear doesn’t mean being fearless. Fear is important—it keeps us alive. But there are certain fears we can live without, especially the ones that hold us back from seeking help or having honest conversations.

Murray: I love that. Earlier, you mentioned two words—“fuel” and “suffering.” Can you unpack those a little? Why do they resonate with you in the context of mental health?

Daniel: Absolutely. In the world I work in, most people—business owners, leaders, entrepreneurs—are chasing something: a goal, a dream. That pursuit is fuelled by energy, passion, and drive. But too often, it’s at the expense of their own wellbeing.
They dip into their reserves—mentally and physically—to push forward. And that leads to suffering. I’ve met many brilliant people who don’t look or feel great, even though they’re outwardly successful. There’s something missing, or their energy doesn’t match the level of achievement. I’ve been there too.

Murray: What happens when someone opens up to you? What does that actually look like? And how do you know when to just listen versus when to refer someone on?

Daniel: Great question—and something I’m very conscious of, especially since launching Without Fear. Some things definitely need professional help. We have amazing resources out there—psychologists, GPs, Lifeline, Beyond Blue, etc. But many people don’t even take that first step because they don’t know where to start or who to talk to.
I try to lead by example. I share my own journey, even though it can be painful. And often, people reach out later—maybe not immediately—but they’ll text or call and say, “Can we have a chat?” or “I’m not doing so great.” That opening is huge.
I always start by acknowledging how brave that is—reaching out to someone, especially if we don’t know each other well. Then I just make space. I never say, “I’ll fix you.” I say, “Let’s talk about it. I’m on my own journey too—let’s walk together.”

Murray: That’s powerful. But some people might worry that telling their own story could come across as self-indulgent or even inappropriate. How do you navigate that risk?

Daniel: Yeah, I get that. Some people might think I’m airing my dirty laundry or that I’ve misread the room. And I’m OK with that risk.
Because honestly, I don’t care what those people think. What matters to me are the one or two people who really need to hear it—people whose lives it might change or even save. My heart still races when I tell my story, but it resonates where it matters. That’s me living without fear.

Murray: That ROI—return on investment—is pretty clear. Hard to measure, but undeniably valuable.
Daniel: I’ll make that investment every time.

Murray: You mentioned a friend who had both back pain and mental health issues, and people only ever asked about his back. Why do you think it’s still hard to talk about mental health in the same way we talk about physical pain?

Daniel: It’s complex and emotional. Especially for men—but not exclusively—there’s a toxic masculinity around vulnerability. Leaders feel pressure to keep up appearances. And it all goes back to primal instincts—if you look weak, you’re vulnerable.
But it’s also just uncomfortable. It’s not something we’ve been taught how to discuss. There’s no clear path like “stitch it and it heals.”

Murray: And in your EOS coaching work, what do you see leadership teams doing—or failing to do—that affects mental wellbeing in their businesses?

Daniel: One concept gaining traction is psychological safety. You can’t scare people into being less afraid. You can’t fix your culture with a company barbecue.
You need to be real and authentic. That includes sharing your own vulnerabilities. At EOS, we start Level 10 meetings with personal and professional good news. If someone doesn’t have any personal good news, that’s worth talking about.
Creating space for honesty—saying, “I’m not doing so great”—starts with the leader going first. Otherwise, you end up with artificial harmony, and that’s dangerous.

Murray: And when someone actually says, “I’m not okay,” people often freeze. They don’t know what to say and default to “You’ll be right.” What should they say instead?

Daniel: Start by acknowledging their courage. Say, “Thank you for telling me.”
Then follow up with open questions: “Tell me more. When did this start? How can I help?”
You don’t need all the answers. Just be present. Let them know you’re there and you’ll work it out together. That alone is powerful.
I’ve got two young kids, and when they scrape their knee, saying “You’ll be fine” doesn’t help. You sit with them, ask where it hurts, clean the scrape, give comfort. Same concept here—different kind of triage.

Murray: So with Without Fear, what does success look like for you?

Daniel: Just before launching, I sat down with my parents to talk them through what I was doing. That led to some of the most meaningful conversations I’ve ever had—especially with my dad, who’s from a generation where vulnerability wasn’t the norm.
That’s what success looks like: conversations that wouldn’t have happened otherwise—conversations that might save lives.
We’re also pledging 100% of our profits from selling apparel like t-shirts and hoodies to projects that support mental health. We want the Without Fear brand to be a beacon—if you see someone wearing it, you know they’re safe to talk to.

Murray: That’s fantastic. If people want to learn more or get involved, where should they go?

Daniel: Head to withoutfearco.com, or find us on social media @withoutfearco. We’re regularly sharing content and looking forward to investing in our first community project before the end of the year.

Murray: Brilliant. Thanks so much, Dan—and well done to you and your team.

Daniel: Appreciate it. Thanks, Murray.